We didn't think we would one day have to deal with a dog's excessive barking, when we had Cookie only, as Cookie had rarely barked since he was a puppy, although he had a problem of biting instead.On contrary to Cookie, Cinnamon barks a lot, especially when she sees other dogs, though her barking is not an aggressive one, it is rather a barking from over-excitement and a bit of nervousness.
When I started walking Cookie and Cinnamon together, even Cookie started barking along with Cinnamon. They didn't only bark but also tried to jump at other dogs that they met on the street. It was so embarrassing that I tried hard to stop their unwanted behaviour.
At that time I visited YouTube every night to watch dog training videos, from Cesar Millan the Dog Whisperer to Jan Fennell the Dog Listener. After reading a book written by Jan Fannell ('The Dog Listener: Learn How to Communicate with Your Dog for Willing Cooperation'), I tried ignoring Cinnamon whenever I entered a room where Cinnamon was, but it didn't make any difference. Also, every week I watched 'It's Me or The Dog' and tried techniques Victoria Stilwell recommended to the owners of badly behaved dogs.
Without seeing any good outcome from my efforts, I came to think that it was only Flip, an acclaimed dog behaviorist, who could change Cinnamon's behaviour. He had helped us solve Cookie's biting problem when he was a puppy.
One day I visited his training school without an appointment. When I arrived there, Flip was busy training a couple of dogs, so I talked to his assistant and told her what problem I had with my dogs. Then, she said "Barking is one of the easiest problems to correct. We use PetSafe's bark control collars." Of course, she didn't mean anyone could stop a dog's barking problem if he/she used that special equipment. But, Flip's training fees were over our budget. So, I decided to tackle the problem on my own using a bark control collar.
Remembering that Flip's assistant told me that the collar they used was a type which gives a static shock, I looked for a bark control collar of that type on New Zealand's biggest online auction site, TradeMe, as well as checking reviews of bark control collars. As there didn't seem to be much difference between PetSafe products and Innotek products, I bought an Innotek No-Bark Collar second hand at TradeMe.The result was: Cinnamon reacted too much to the static shocks. Although the collar is designed so that it starts with a little shock and gradually increases the strength until the dog stops barking, I had no way to make sure the collar was working as designed. Cinnamon gave a yelp and hid her tail between her hinder legs when she was given a static shock. She was so scared of the collar that she became kind of traumatic to anything that she had to wear. So, in the end I stopped using the collar without seeing any success. Now she hides under a dining table whenever I bring a harness or collar to take her out for a walk, even though she loves walking.
Pros
- The mechanism is simple
- It doesn't do any physical harm to dogs
- Perhaps it would work for some dogs (There are many review comments saying that the product worked well)
Cons
- It looks easy to use but it actually isn't
- It doesn't work for sensitive dogs like Cinnamon
Verdict
Oh dear, poor Cinnamon - I think you're right - she was probably not a suitable kind of dog for this kind of training tool. OR - it may be that you needed the guidance of somebody very experienced with this kind of training equipment (eg. Flip - but I know what you mean: he is so expensive!!) - to help you when you start because there is always the danger that an inexperienced person might use it incorrectly and cause more problems for the dog. I think that is why these kinds of collars get a very bad reputation because they can be dangerous if not used correctly and - as you found out - they are not that easy to just use by yourself, without any guidance from an experienced dog trainer.
ReplyDeleteI know a lot of people are horrified at the idea of an electronic collar but they can be very good, effective training tools if used with the right dog and in the right situation...We have actually used a similar collar on Honey when she was going through her "bad time" and pulling and lunging at other dogs (she didn't bark but it still looked VERY scary!!) - I had no control over her and it was very stressful walking her - this was the time we took her to Flip and he recommended the electronic collar and it worked like a miracle. We did a few lessons with Flip and he helped show us how to use the collar properly and which setting to use. Honey changed her behaviour within just a few times of correcting her with the collar. But she did not seem to have any of the bad associations that Cinnamon developed - I think because she never associated the discomfort with the collar - she thought it came from the environment (like thunder or lightenig) and that it happened because she disobeyed. So she used to (and still does) get very excited and happy and wag her tail whenever she saw us take out the collar - she just associated it with going for a walk! Maybe also her personality is more suitable - she is quite a confident dog and copes well with being surprised by scary things(one of the things they assessed her for in Therapy work) but again, we needed Flip to assess her and see that she is suitable for the collar - he says some dogs are too sensitive and nervous to use it (and some dogs are too "hard" and don't feel anything!!).
Using the electronic collar really helped us to teach her to walk nicely next to us, past another dog in the street without pulling - and also to have very good Recall - without this collar, I don't think she would have as good as Recall as she does now. But most of all, it gave me confidence because she was too strong for me to control when she went crazy but after the collar, she really respected me and now we hardly ever use it - she just listens when I say something.
However, I understand why people are so worried about the collar because there is a danger that some dog owners may abuse it and use it for every small thing and really traumatise the dog (I don't mean you! but you know some of these lazy dog owners who just want a "quick fix"!) - I think it should only be used for serious behavioural problems (like aggression or physical out-of-control) which are dangerous if not "fixed" - I don't know if I agree with using the collar for problems like barking. I think in that case it is better to find the reason for the barking and try to change that. For example, in your case, if Cinnamon is barking from nervousness - perhaps you are reinforcing her fear of other dogs (without realising you're doing it) - so if you could change her attitude to other dogs (ie. make her less nervous), then you can start to change her behaviour also. I hope I'm making sense! :-)
Is Cinnamon still barking at other dogs? Perhaps this is something we can work on training together! :-)
Hsin-Yi
Also - have you heard that often, teaching a dog to bark on command can help to teach him to be quiet also? You can teach the bark on command very easily using clicker (especially if your dog likes to bark anyway!) - and then you can teach the "silence-on-command" - which you can then use when she is barking at the wrong time! :-) But it is like toilet-training in the beginning: you have to supervise A LOT so you can be there to correct the wrong behaviour...but if you can do that, the dog won't get a chance to do the "wrong behaviour" and after some time, he will change his habits.
ReplyDeleteSorry for such long comments!!!
Hsin-Yi
My experience with teaching Jackal to bark on command was great. Jackal loves to bark and I'd heard that teaching them to speak can help, so I did it. One drawback was that once he learned to speak, he tried barking during our entire training lesson wanting me to click (sometimes even while doing other behaviors). I ended up having to turn my back on him when he would bark and ignore him until we was quiet. Now he only barks once when I ask him to speak, so it worked well for us.
ReplyDeleteHave you tried using Victoria Stilwell's method where she would have the dog sit and do the "watch me" command, continually feeding treats while another dog is walked past so that she begins to associate other dogs with treats? You might have to start out thirty yards away. As far away as it takes to get her attention and slowly move closer. I really like this method (although I've never needed to use it yet) because it actually changed their whole association to other dogs. Let us know how it goes!
Keep it up, it sounds like you're making progress. When she rolls over its just because they came too close too soon and pushed her out of her comfort zone. Conditioning her to have a good association with other dogs will take time. Don't give up.
ReplyDeleteOh how frustrating for you. Honey has told me all about that nice trainer so I am confident that he will help you figure things out.
ReplyDeleteEven a "normal" beagle can be quite chatty and they do have lovely voices.
I can't believe you actually know Honey! I am so jealous because she is so big and blond. Stop by and visit me sometime.
Slobbers,
Mango
Hey guys! Well, we found this post most useful..and even more so the comments. We have used static collars on all ours with varying degrees of success....Alfie is a changed dog (yes, it's him in the pic!) but Rosie would totally ignore the collar and continue with the behaviour....even with it turned right up she didn't seem to care so I stopped using it! I "dummied" it on my lot for a good few weeks before actually using it so they thought the shock was a direct result of their own behaviour, ie. not looking at Mum when she calls gives me this shock etc.
ReplyDeleteI have the exact same barking problem with Rosie, if anyone gets near our pack...whether it's on the beach or in the car, wherever, she will bark like mad, almost screaming. I think i'll give the Victoria Stilwell method a go, I hadn't heard that one before....thanks Jackal & Storm's owner!
Good luck and perhaps we could let each other know how we get on?
Slobbers xx
Hello and very nice to meet you, Cookie and Cinnamon! Thanks for coming by our blog. You two have cute names and we just feel like giving you BIG licks! :)
ReplyDeleteIt's nice to hear that your grandparent used to have a CKCS, Junior! :) You know if we trim our body hair, we would look like Beagle! :)
Our mom thinks this post is VERY interesting! I Momo never bark but I Pinot does since I was bitten by an agressive dog when I was a pup. :( Our pawrents thought about getting the same type of collar but they couldn't forget the image from The Tonight Show or something. One HUMAN put the similar collar on his neck and he was actually in pain after the shock was given.
Our pawrents found that I Pinot is easily interacted by hodling a stick or a frisbee when we walk. Yes,I have to admit I love holding something and when I do, I don't feel like barking. :) Now I don't bark when we walk and our pawrents are happy!
Momo & Pinot
ps: We'd love to add your names to our friends' list.. hope it's ok with you!